ProductiviTree: Cultivating Efficiency, Harvesting Joy

ProductiviTree #22 From Broke to $100M: The Long Shot Leader's Playbook

• Santiago Tacoronte • Season 1 • Episode 22

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Michael Stein, who built a $100M+ company from scratch, shares his unconventional wisdom on entrepreneurship, personal development, and leadership. We explore his "Long Shot Leaders" philosophy, discovering how his experiences as an actor, comedian, and filmmaker shaped his unique approach to business. Get ready for actionable strategies to overcome obstacles, build a sustainable business, and achieve extraordinary success.

Takeaways

  • Growing up with failure shaped my entrepreneurial spirit.
  • I started my first business with only $28.
  • Time plus effort equals success in any endeavor.
  • Gratitude is essential for long-term success.
  • You can be an entrepreneur regardless of age or background.
  • Understanding human needs enhances leadership effectiveness.

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Michael Stein is a serial entrepreneur, filmmaker and podcast host whose life has been anything but ordinary. Diagnosed with behavior disorders as a child, Michael found inspiration in the movie Rocky, leading him to become a fitness trainer at 16 and a stand-up comedian by 19. He went on to promote Hollywood nightclubs, starring the original short film The Dirk Diggler Story by Paul Thomas Anderson, and later pivoted into entrepreneurship, founding TarpsPlus.com, with just $13 in his bank account. The company became a multi-million dollar success. Along the way, Michael produced award-winning films, launched charitable projects like TarpAid 8, and now hosts the Long Shot Leaders podcast, where he celebrates underdog stories of people who turn long odds into big wins. Michael, welcome to Productivity. pleasure to be here, I'm excited to get into it with you today, thanks. Michael, your background is incredibly diverse. Nightclub promoter, CEO, actor, comedian. What is the thread that connects all these experiences? Um, I think it's growing up with a lot of failure and also, you know, um, your upbringing and your parents, you know, um, to do as best as you can and to be, uh, to, hustle. was a word, you know, growing up as a kid in the seventies, you know, there would be a song called the hustle. My dad would, you know, he was a homeless, uh, street kid in New York. So, uh, he never was educated about the eighth grade, but then he became a multimillionaire. lost it, but then kind of navigate it out of it to have somewhat success again. So I think that seeing the algorithm of that failure and success on my mom's side, her family escaped the Russian concentration camps. So just seeing this kind of struggle and hustle and taking pride in hustle and being okay with failure, I think you know, when it came time for me to do different things, I said, well, this is just part of my growth as either as an artist, as a business person, as a human being. And that's why I always looked at things. You famously built a hundred million dollar company. Wow. And all from the ground up. Can you take us back to the early days and share the moments when you decided to go all in on your entrepreneurship? Right. So my first job, know, my first, you know, for you as an entrepreneur, I failed miserably and the tool business, I graduated high school the day after I started a tool business and I didn't do well. And then I became like six months later, I, you know, did stand up comedy. I've got a lot of people there. So I became a nightclub promoter because I, you know, which had nothing to with stand up comedy, but I was able to bring a lot of people to my stand up routine. then nightclubs were like big in the late eighties. So I did really well with that. You a lot of people and I tried to become a filmmaker and I did some films, you know, taking through a fast track of many years of like seven, eight years of working in production, producing, writing, directing, acting. And I did a short film, won many awards, got bought by HBO and just, I got close to a movie deal because that's how you get a movie deal in Hollywood. You do a short film, that's one way to do it. and then you get a lot of meetings. And I got close to making my own movie, but no movie deal after this whole thing. And I said, I've got to become an entrepreneur again because I want to make my own movie. So it was out of desperation. I was broken in debt, I said, I'm going to, you know, the internet is still pretty young. I want to sell a widget. I want to go back to selling. I don't want go back to selling tools because back when I started, there was no internet, but I was like, what can I sell? So TARPS was an item in a catalog that my dad, who was kind of struggling his way back, doing the old fashioned tool thing. And I said, here's a simple item, a lot of people need it. You could use it for camping or emergency or whatever. So I just tried to sell this on the internet and I called up my tool, my movie business, because I said, is gonna help me make money for the movie. This is a side thing. And within the first eight months, I made you know, well over a quarter million dollars. And I said, okay, I'm off on my way to make a movie. And then like a year later, I was able to make a movie called Love Hollywood Style, which we casted myself, a rope director, producer and acted with Faye Dunaway, Andy Day-Cooley. And I was like, okay, I'm acting. I was able to make this movie with the money I had from being an entrepreneur. And I'm acting with an Academy Award actress. And I said, okay, this is great. It almost. bottomed out my business because it was like, you know, it's expensive to make a movie. But I was so addicted to that, you know. By the time I was done with that movie, I said, you know, and that movie didn't make all its money back. I said, I should take care of this business, you know. And ever since then, I've been able to do other projects and other things since then. But I really nurtured the business and it's earned well over a hundred million since then, ah which is. Pretty good, it's not a hundred million dollar company, it's earned over hundred million dollars since then, well over that, since then. But the impressive thing was is I was broke in debt, I had $28 in my bank account. So I guess you could say I had debt on top of that though. And I was able to build a Yahoo store and open up tarpsplus.com and it's done well ever since. And that's how I started working out of my rented shack in Sherman Oaks, California. and started to set up canopies and hold inventory in the backyard there. And Todd was kicked out by this LA city and said, you gotta get a warehouse. And then I moved to a warehouse and I bought a warehouse and it's grown exponentially ever since. Many people feel stuck in a nine to five mentality. I mean, you have gone from actor from movies to tarps. So what mindset shifts did you have to make you embrace the long shot mentality? Well, I grew up as a, you know, I was a long shot. do the podcast, Long Shot Leaders, and I, I consider myself a long shot. You know, I, was born premature health issues, AD, ADHD, whatever they call it. They didn't know I was put in a special needs school. They didn't have ADHD, that moniker when I was a kid. And growing up with my dad, who's, you know, you know, he was not, not around a lot, but I was hearing the story. You know, he was homeless. He ran away from the orphanage when he was eight. You know, my grandmother, I had, I was the youngest, so had to sleep in the same room with my grandmother until off and on until I was nine years old. So she would tell me my bedtime story was how she escaped the Russian concentration camps. So I, you know, always consider myself a long shot and I, you know, was always awkward. I really never had any success. I make people laugh. That was the one thing I was able to do. And then I said, okay, well that's, I have success doing that. That's good. And then I saw the movie Rocky, like most American kids, was, you I said, here's a guy like me, you know, he's funny. He tries real hard. He keeps on getting knocked down, keeps on getting it back up because, I'm a hustler. The only thing different to this guy is that he was physically fit and I was really, I had a lot of health issues. So that day, every day I'm going to work out like Rocky. So that was like, it was like 11 or 12. And then since then I, worked out every day and by the time I was 16 I became a physical fitness trainer. I was like one of my first jobs and I said, oh man, another thing, time plus effort equals success. And that's kind of like how I, that was my mentality. Time plus effort, it doesn't matter how poor of a student I was, hey my dad never finished the eighth grade, he became multi-millionaire and he made a lot of mistakes afterwards but at least I can learn from those mistakes. time plus effort and then just growing, building my muscle. My muscle to be an entrepreneur, my muscle to be a static comedian, my muscle to be an actor, my muscle to be healthy. And that's what I've stood by ever since. And it's a long distance run. So I knew that all these mistakes that I was doing would be learning experiences and that was always been my mentality. You've mentioned starting a business with $20, $28, I think you said. What are the top three strategies or the top strategies for bootstrapping a business in those circumstances? Okay. So I was really methodical about it. You know, I love to tell you the story. Like when you see the movie chaplain with, you know, Robert Downey jr. How he says he became chaplain and the cane just like enters his hand and that hat rolls on his head and the mustache just kind of came to him and all that. No, when I, you know, I think a lot of people should really kind of open, you know, go on the internet and this is what I did, you know, back in 1999. And I would say, okay, where's the opportunity? You know, what's the competition look like? How much can I get the product for? What are people selling the product for? Let me put this out in my head. Can I see this scaling? What's the upside? What's the downside? Ask myself critical questions. The who, what, where, why, when, and how of the situation. What's the potential? So then you start to look for that. And I looked long and hard for the opportunity. was like, okay, I can get this widget for a lower cost. I see the competition's not selling it. as much as at all. I said, see there's an opportunity here and I could see myself doing this and it's sustainable. It's doable. And you start to kind of like, so my strategy was, it, get scope of the situation. You're gonna probably ask me, what's your 10 point strategy or whatever. But the first thing is, doing anything is get scope of the situation. The who, what, where, why, when and how. And then Toyota asks like five whys. I don't know you're familiar with that, like DS Demings after World War II taught Toyota how to become a critical company. And they said they adopted something called the five whys. And then when something's wrong with their engine or something, said, why is that? Why is that? Why is that? Why is that? And they asked five times. I like to ask, you know, the who, what, where, why, when, and how at least five times to get total scope of the situation. Hope this is not too long-winded. And then when do you get the scope of the situation, then you start to take immediate action to give yourself momentum psychologically and also you because if you would schedule something you know if you talk about something it's a possibility but if you schedule it it's real you know so that that's the immediate action you know if i want to be able to get in good shape well i'm going to create a schedule i'm going to do something immediately like when i'm able to do that workout force myself to do something immediately so that's kind like you know how the beginning of the business was you know you get in there You get scope of the situation, you find your opportunities, you take immediate action, you start to write down as much as you can, you start to have, what's your end goal? um And you start to kind of mold this. You don't have to have all the answers in the beginning, but start to mold this. And that's kind of like the incipient stages of my business, of starting a business, from bootstrapping without any money. Stick to the opportunities where you don't need money also. Building a sustainable business looks more like a marathon than a sprint. So what are some key principles for long-term growth and avoiding number one, burnout, and also something that I see more often now, getting bored? Hmm. Okay. Well, the last two are kind of related to each other burnout and getting bored, getting the, uh, what was the first part? What are the strategies to build this long-term growth without knowing that it's a marathon, without getting burnt out or, you know, to... scaling pretty much, right? um So the first thing is that you want to be able to be conservative with saving money, but also be aggressive with how to make money. So it's a fine line. So you want to keep, always in business, even when you want to take calculated risks sometimes with money, but you've got to be, sometimes you don't have a choice. You're like, I have no choice. I only have X amount. um But you also want to say, know, when it comes to advertising, you have to really find what is going to work for you and then quadruple down on that. And then you want to be very cognitive of like what's not going to work, know, as far as spending money marketing wise. Because look, that's what's going to help you scale. That's what's going to help you grow. This is going to be marketing and advertising. are the key, the KPIs, you know, the key performance indicators are going to show you on how to make this happen. wanna be uber hyper about that and say, okay. The other thing is is that, you know, in the beginning, you wanna romanticize staying up all night or doing whatever you gotta do or every moment for your business. It's clay, you wanna mold it, you wanna say, can, you you're in the driver's seat now. So we just focus on that. This kinda like helps you know that lack of burnout. Always realize that if you're an entrepreneur, you're in the driver's seat. That's a liberating feeling. So if you really start to really think about, I can control this, I can wake up two o'clock in the morning if I wish, and I can mold my business, I can do things to help it move forward. That's liberating. Now as far as burnout is concerned, you have to really kind of always focus on what are the goals? There's thing goals, there's material goals, there are, you know. Goal, you know, spiritual goals, all kinds of goals. They all help you motivate you. And also pain. You want to focus on, I don't do this, you know, so basically it's pain and pleasure principles. And you just want, that's what helps you stay away from burnout. Cause everybody gets burnt out and say, well, wait a second. If I don't do this, what kind of pain will that bring me? And if I do that, what will, what pleasure will that bring me? and then you break down your pleasure into your thing goals, your materialistic goals, your spiritual goals, all your health goals, all the things that are gonna move your blood. And that's kind of like the strategy that I How has the movie industry influenced the way you conduct other types of businesses? Well, that was really good because I wanted it so bad and there's so much rejection, you know, and there's so much, you know, growing up in Los Angeles, there's so much pretentiousness, rejection. There's a lot of positivity too. Growing up Los Angeles, lot of personal development is very prevalent there. So I was able to grow up in a place that was about psychology and a lot of big melting pot. So, uh personal development's been a big part of my life. So getting involved in the movie industry, I was able to really learn how to, and also stand up comedy, to learn how to deal with rejection, learn on how to force yourself to be a writer, to be a director, to work with people, to be creative, to be a critical thinker, to really sit and think and strategize. You didn't want to write direct produced act. You know, you want to do those things to learn about human psychology and break down a character. And how does that coincide with, you know, personal development psychology and likewise with standup comedy? You know, when I, when I got to, you know, I did a Tony Robbins, uh, which I've done like everything has never done. I went on, was, I heavily got involved in, um, personal development, it went back to do standup comedy. And I got into six human needs psychology, which There's a brief, you know, the theory behind that is why people do what they do. They do it for six human needs, know, emotional needs that they have to feel significant love, contribution, growth, security and significance. So these human needs, if you give somebody that while you're doing standup, you make the crowd feel secure, you know, important. connected, love, like feel like they're contributing to something, you're trying to, whatever, if I can make these people feel like those six of my needs, then it's going to help me enroll them. That's same with business, same with acting, same with whatever. So the movie industry has helped me integrate all these things and it's really helped me a lot. also helped me uh see a lot of... big part of the world, being in that circle. When I was 21 years old, getting to, would meet the right people, get flying around on the air jet, meeting people that have really done a lot with their life, that was really impactful for me. ah And that helped me grow quite a bit and see other parts of the world and the possibilities. What are some common misconceptions about entrepreneurship that you'd to dispel today? That you need money, that's just one avenue to be an entrepreneur. ah That it needs to be the right time or you're not young enough or you're not old enough. It doesn't really matter. There's no rules here. Those are all just limiting beliefs. You have to really kind of seek out. there's a bunch of them that people give themselves excuses on why they, well, I can't be an entrepreneur because of this. or I'm not built for that. This is all bullshit. just really need to anybody can be an entrepreneur, you need to find out your thumbprint, what will enable you, where's your strength? people say, well, I wanna feel passionate. Mike Rowe, who's a famous guy out here, he does a TV show, and he talks about passion versus opportunity. You could be really passionate about that. I was really passionate about being an uh actor, filmmaker. I wanted to say, like to think the Academy. And I've had friends that have done that. ah But at the same time, you also look at opportunity and say, wait, what's my long-term goal here? I want to be successful in not just one effort, but other things. So seek opportunity because the myth is that, I have to do it if I feel passionate about it. You'll feel passionate about it if you're successful and then you can still stick with your passions. Who knows, maybe your opportunity will pay for your passion. So those are some of the myths. Try to find your thumbprint and your ability and where opportunity lies for you and if it coincides with some of your passions, that's a win. So that's what I can say about You're big on personal development and you have a background in human needs psychology. How does understanding these needs contribute to effective leadership? Well, you'll understand that you don't get upset at people more because then there's people do uh try to attain, people will violate their beliefs in order to meet their emotional needs. So somebody will say, well, I believe that, but I'm doing this oh to feel people, whatever they do, you get, you might get angry at somebody or you might say, why are they not listening to me? More often than not test it out. You're, know, once you get good at this and you start to study it, everybody's trying to meet emotional need. Why did they do that? They try to do that to meet it. feel more secure. They try to make themselves feel more significant. They tried to do that because they wanted to feel connected. They tried to do that because they wanted to feel loved. They tried to do that because they wanted to feel like a sense of contribution. And a lot of these are integrated. They tried to do that because they try to feel a sense of variety. Why would they sacrifice that? Because they wanted to feel a sense of variety. They wanted to change. They don't want to keep on doing the same thing. So all these these six human needs. Once you start to manage people, you don't get upset. He's like, OK. They either tried to get that need through a negative vehicle or a positive vehicle. Now we've all tried to get needs through a negative vehicle, you know? So it's helped me be more patient. It's helped me kind of make better choices. ah What's a positive vehicle? Well, the triad of a good decision is usually, you know, the three things. If it's good for me, if it's good for you, it's good for the greater good. That's usually gonna be a good decision. generals and presidents that have to go to war, that's compromised and that's tough because that try and can't be existing for that because it's not good for the greater good to go to war. But usually for an individual decision, it works. It's not perfect with science, but it's almost a perfect art form. And that's kind of like how I could tell people to start to analyze that, kind of think about that. Why did that person do that? I would definitely get into personal development, whether it's Tony Robbins or something else. learn more about this as well because it can sound like kind of archaic or what I'm talking about if you haven't studied it. You have had software ADHD, dyslexia, health challenges. What are your top strategies for overcoming obstacles and maximizing your potential? So, scope, again, if somebody says, somebody told me as an adult that I had ADHD, I didn't know why I was putting it in something, at UCLA they put me in a school, in Fern Hall school for a year, I didn't know why, I'm just different. And then thank God I grew up in Los Angeles where being different or I'm eccentric or awkward, that's a gift, so a lot of people thought he's special in a good way. I go back for people that don't grow up in that, where that's kind of like lauded. So I kind of looked at it that way, but I would strategize on, if you have weak points, say, okay, I accept that might be a weak point today, but I could turn that into a strength tomorrow. And really start to analyze. So when somebody told me I'd had ADHD, like 10 years ago, I looked at it and I was like, okay, I check every box of what they're saying here. Then my daughter got it. I don't know if it's ready to, I don't know if I believe in this, but I'll tell you what. I'll look at the strengths that they'd say ADHD gives you, got Einstein's right by me, right? They say he had ADHD. I'm like, okay, great. I'll grab onto that. Then you take the things that you might, that might be challenges for you of whatever you might have and say, well, let me try to work on those and see how I can combat those things. So that's how I look at everything. It's an opportunity, you know, and then inner dialogue is really important too. So how do you change your emotions? Cause that's what the light bulb of the engine is to help. and would ask myself empowering questions as opposed to disempowering questions. I would spend maybe about 20 seconds on my problem and say, I acknowledge there's a problem and I accept it. Now I'm gonna ask myself empowering questions like, what's great about this? What can I learn from this? What's funny about this? How can I use this to my advantage? What's interesting about this? And I would start to stack those rather than saying, why does this happen to me? What's wrong with me? Why did I do that? Those are disempowering questions, so I would concentrate on those. And that's part of the algorithm of how I would start to deal with adversity. Michael, the business world, and you have mentioned in this interview the word, or hustle culture. What is your perspective on work-life balance and sustainable success? So you wanna be, there's levels of consciousness. say that it's not Maslov's belief of the table of consciousness, which is a theory in the 40s and 50s. And I do think it's kind of like a great find. So you wanna be integrated. There's a infancy consciousness. There's like a, there's a power god or tribalism consciousness. There's a power god I will take, I will control the tribe. There's law and order. There's Striver Driver, which is an entrepreneurial consciousness. There's like Global, which is like, you know, more of like a consciousness level of like, you know, it's higher. And then there's like a level of, of, you know, of integrated, you know, they say Gandhi had levels of being integrated on all these levels of consciousness. And the way to strategize that is to basically, you know, you want to be able to, to ask yourself what, what, What's my priority, you as far as that's concerned? ah So I don't know that's answering your question, but the life balance is you want to be able to have all of these things integrated, you know, to have a higher consciousness level. It's great that you want to be an achiever and that's important. And there's a time and place for you to do that. When you get to a certain age, you're going want to have a fulfilling life. And that's part of success. Your health is part of success. It works integrated with your finances. Your relationships, how you handle relationships is how you're handle your finances. How you handle your health is gonna handle your relationships. These are all integrated and you wanna make sure that you have a level of consciousness and you wanna be integrated because if you're not, you're not gonna be to your full potential. You're not gonna make as much money as you can. You're not gonna be as healthy as you can. Your relationships, you know, I'll tell you what, you get a bad husband or wife, you'll see how... well your finances are gonna be affected. That's gonna affect your, know, every decision's important and every avenue of your life is important. So balance it well. Sometimes business has to take precedence. You have to concentrate on that more. But you know, there is a time and place for everything. You're gonna have to navigate that and really be careful on all that. I'd say as far as Asian is concerned, when you're in 20s and you're 30s and even 40s, that's the time to spend a lot of time on making money in your business, but don't neglect your health or your relationships. But you will need to double down on making money because that's the time to really strive. So as far as that's concerned. You host the Long Shot Leaders podcast. What are some recurring themes that you have observed in the leaders that you have interviewed? There's the algorithm. I'm always searching for an algorithm of like, has made these people successful? And I've come to a conclusion in these, you know, I think I'm at like, you know, cause I do two other podcasts. I was doing four for a while. One for outdoors, know, Bolotor, which is a brand of mine. We're just launching the DIY not podcast, which is for my other company, Tarts Plus, which is the one I started in 2000. And Long Shot Leaders, the main one, you know, that I really kind of like. I'm always saying, what's the main thing? So here's the main thing. A lot of people that are successful in any way, or form, the lifeblood of the engine is gratitude. They start with a level of gratitude in some way, or form. They have a healthy sense of ego, a healthy sense, and they have gratitude towards whatever they have. Now you might say somebody is like, I know wealthy people who don't have gratitude. They might have levels of gratitude. You know, deep down they might be dysfunctional on one, but that's in spite of their success. Their level of gratitude usually is the lifeblood at the edge that helps them be successful in the long run. Michael, let's do rapid fire questions, answering 30 seconds or less. Number one, your top must read book for entrepreneurs. oh There's two. can't, you know, well, I like the 48 laws of power. I've had uh Robert Green, who wrote the book on my podcast, ah and Dale Carnegie's Think and Grow Rich. I know it's a cliche, but it's such a good book, you know. So those two books, uh the 48 laws of power can be used for good or evil. ah And I would um also... You gotta throw in any book that Tony Robbins, I just love Tony, uh met him a couple times and I hate to be like such a uber about him but look, that's a good start business with personal development and then Dale Carnegie, Think and Grow Rich, ah The Purple Cow, there's so many good books. ah The first book I ever read was on selling was Tom Hopkins, on selling when I was a. 17 or 18, I read that book. So that's a really good book on selling. It was done in the 80s, but it's still good. I would start there, but I would not, I would just start reading, you know, this is the great, can I give you a great hack? hear a really good, fun, fun hack, guys? It's so easy to get content these days. Anybody listening right now, if you guys like listening to audio, like I have a 10 acre property, so sometimes I'll do my own lawn, but I hate wasting time. So I'll do what I call it that time, right? You know, I'll listen to audio content while I'm moving. ah So you can do this, can chat GBT, the greatest points of any book and then take, and then have chat GBT, take that script and then take that and then you put it into a voice actor. You know, like the voice you hear on like Instagram, there's always like a video and it's like, how many times you want to, you know, that voice and have that guy. guy's voice, create an audio file. I created just yesterday, 46 minutes of some of my greatest books that I wanted to spend time on. And I said, I don't have time. I just want the meat. I just want the bullet points. I also wanted to read it, to listen to it over and over again. So it gets my nervous system. So it's like second nature. And I told you how to do this. And here's the last bit of hack. said, chat, my chat GBT knows me really well because it's got the memory in the archives, right? I said, I also want it to take my goals for the next two to three years and I want it to bullet point some of the actions that we've gone over and I want it to put it in script form for me to listen back on audio. So I listened to it after that. I haven't done it yet. I'm supposed to listen to this, what it prepared for me in the next couple days. But I would say read as much as you can. Those are my books that I suggested. But also, what a great day and age. can just like, like a robot, like you create your own destiny with all this content. uh I would try to that hack. think I'm looking forward to trying it myself. That was a bit more than 30 seconds Michael, let's try it again. One habit that has been a game changer for your productivity. Habit has been my game changer for projectivity. ah Trigger and response, uh making sure that I have internal dialogue, working it like a muscle to where I'm constantly asking myself empowering questions as opposed to disempowering questions. And then coming up with an incantation, which is basically telling myself I can do this, I will do this, this is why can do this, count on my blessings, this is what I've done in the past, this is why I'm gonna do this, this is how I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna do it now, I'm gonna do it, give myself a date. And I kinda like, know, when I really need, oh when I'm really down, I will use incantations with empowering questions. And that will lead me in the right direction. It'll move your blood and you'll be able to take action immediately. best piece of advice you've ever received. I just heard somebody ask that question on an Instagram post. I was like, that's a good question. I never asked that myself on my podcast. Peter Gruber, the name drop. I was dating his daughter. This is the best piece of advice. It was one of the first pieces of advice and so simplistic. But really think about it when I tell it to you. I was sitting at a restaurant and he gave me some time. I let's talk to Mike because I was, you know, he was trying to help me. They liked me. I was 22 years old. He goes, I was a nightclub promoter at time, and he says, so you're promoting these clubs, so what's your long term, what do want to do? I said, I said eventually I guess I'd like to own the nightclub. He goes, know, why did do that? I said, well, I'm trying. He goes, hey look, there was a pencil on the table. was like, look this pencil. He's like, move that pencil. So I moved the pencil. He goes, did you try to do that or just did it? I said, I know what doing. You're playing semantics here. I know, it's easier for you big old. you know, billionaire, you you're telling me, you know, just move the pencil. But it's true. If you start to think about things like, why don't I just do that? Why, why not ask myself questions that say I can do this? I will do this. It's just a matter of time and effort if I really want to do it. So just move the pencil. That's, that's the best advice ever. your favorite productivity tool or app. Well, what I just told you, that's a pretty cool one. You know, I mean, come on, you could read all these books. could just bullet point it and then you can just tailor it towards your action items. That's a pretty damn good hack. If I do so say, I'm telling you, if you, know, that's my, that's my number one hack right now. Chat GBT, anything and bullet point, just the key points of that content. So you're not spending a lot of time on getting that information. Now, of course, you might need to read it to understand it. But once you understand it, bullet point it and then tailor chat GBT with your actions on what you need to do. This is a great time and place. You're a tailor making your destiny. All you need to do now is just follow through with it. It's just, just take step A to step Z. If you don't do those steps, that's on you. But at least you had the best coach and AI coach to help you, you know, in that process. That's my, that's my. One last rapid question. What's one thing most people don't know about you? Uh, well, I know I'm Jewish. They, uh, um, they know they don't know. You know, I gotta tell you, it's such an open book. I don't know what people don't know about me because I put it all online. They, you know, they know that I'm insecure. Uh, still that that's what they don't know. I still can get insecure because right now after all this. And that never goes away. That's okay. I'm confident about being insecure. That's the difference. But people might be surprised to know that I still have insecurities and here's the secret everybody does. Tony Robbins has insecurities. Everyone's got insecurities, but I have them too. So maybe people don't know that because we do podcasts. You seem like, Santiago might seem like those guys, because he's the podcast guy. He's like doing all this content, right? No, we're insecure. We're all just trying to find uh the fulfillment through our six human needs. And the last thing I'll say, I'm a lover like, I never get tired. They might think I get tired. That's the second thing. If somebody saw me on the street or an old friend, I went to my 40th high school reunion and people would think, well, Mike's got a lot going on. So he doesn't care as much to like, you know, really, they're surprised, you know, about how I'm so happy to give someone a hug. I'm so happy to see somebody and find out what they're doing. I do not get tired of people. So those are the two things. I still get sent to this care and I might sound needy, but I really love people. I love their interest. Even somebody that might be adverse to my interest, it'd be interesting to see if we can meet common ground somewhere, somehow. That's my secrets. Michael, for those who want to learn more about you, your work and connect with you, what's the best way for them to connect with you? go to michaelssteinmedia.com. It shows the podcast, the Long Shot Leaders podcast. uh We got a new one coming out, the DIY Not, which is do it yourself projects, which is sponsored by my company, Times Plus. And then Bullitor, which is my new oh backpack brand. talk about outdoor adventure stories. And you can see my bio there and the events and things that are going, coming up. I want to thank you so much for this inspiring conversation. Get to learn you a bit more. The depth of your... Answers, it's something special. I'm living with this, with your kindness and the last bit about being vulnerable and still being nervous, it's something I think a lot of people like me will take away. Thanks, Emilio Michael. Pleasure. Thank you.